PIN2DMD EVO HD - upgrade to 256x64 resolution

[stumblor]

Footage of the HD Pin2DMD in CFTBL

 

 

[lucky1]

Thanks for the video. Looks great ! Check your alignment of the panels. There is a small gap between them.

If you used the magnets to mount them to the PCB you can easily move them a little bit by pushing them at the power or Hub75 connector from the backside

[stumblor]

Yes thanks Joerg, I noticed this myself. Not really noticeable straight on but when filmed from the side....

 

The shutter speed flicker of the video doesn't do it justice - they really look amazing in person. Massive respect for all the hard work. It's a pity the chips are in such short supply, I'm sure many more would be getting made if not.

[Terranigma]

@slippifishi

[lucky1]

3 hours ago, stumblor said:

Yes thanks Joerg, I noticed this myself. Not really noticeable straight on but when filmed from the side....

 

The shutter speed flicker of the video doesn't do it justice - they really look amazing in person. Massive respect for all the hard work. It's a pity the chips are in such short supply, I'm sure many more would be getting made if not.

 

It already looks great when scaling of 128x32 is used, but if artists start to replace the content with 256x64 images it will look even better.

[slippifishi]

Sorry if this was already mentioned in the thread or covered elsewhere, I did look through but didn't see anything. Do I need a new/separate version of the editor for creating HD content? I am currently running v3.0 @ 04.09.2021 05:51:35 (as a side, it would be really helpful if you could maybe keep your first post updated in the PIN2DMD Editor thread with the latest exe, or a link to the folder with the latest builds or something; I think I have the current latest build folder anyway, but sometimes I am not sure if I am looking at the latest stable or a beta version)

 

If I switch the editor to 256x64 mode, it tells me to restart. After a restart I can see the default new project is higher resolution, but if I open an existing project (eg. CFTBL) it falls back to 128x32 for everything and I can't seem to get it back into 256x64 mode. Even with a new project, if I load a 128x32 rom dump (raw or txt) it again falls back to 128x32 mode and no obvious way back that I can see. Is there some way I can open my existing projects and convert to 256x64?

[Terranigma]

1 hour ago, slippifishi said:

If I switch the editor to 256x64 mode, it tells me to restart. After a restart I can see the default new project is higher resolution, but if I open an existing project (eg. CFTBL) it falls back to 128x32 for everything and I can't seem to get it back into 256x64 mode. Even with a new project, if I load a 128x32 rom dump (raw or txt) it again falls back to 128x32 mode and no obvious way back that I can see. Is there some way I can open my existing projects and convert to 256x64?

 

I just dumped something with the 256x64 Pin2dmd hardware and I am getting the same behaviour. My project is 256x64 but loading the dump looks like the dots drops back to 128x32. Same version that you're using too.

[lucky1]

2 hours ago, slippifishi said:

I am currently running v3.0 @ 04.09.2021 05:51:35

That´s the correct version

 

2 hours ago, slippifishi said:

if I load a 128x32 rom dump (raw or txt) it again falls back to 128x32 mode

Dumps represent the data like it is coming from the machine and of course that is with 128x32 dots, even if you use a PIN2DMD HD.

 

Generally all 128x32 colorizations work as they are and are scaled to 256x64 on the device on the fly.

 

If you want to replace a scene with "real" HD content in 256x64 resolution, the easiest way is to first convert the scene using the "Scale Scene" function under the "Scene/Recording" tab and then either add more details to the frames or replace the frames with imported HD content. 

 

For scenes with dynamic content you can either use colormask modes as before or use the "layered replaceMask" mode to partially replace content with HD content, while leaving the other parts just being scaled on the fly. The L-Mask represents the areas which you want to replace and the D-Mask is used to mark the areas to be used to trigger the frame just like in "layered colorMask" mode.

 

All parts that are used to create hashes remain treated in 128x32 because it is like the data comes from the machine. 

 

Of course this is something for advanced editor users who already have sucessfully finished their colorizations on 128x32 and are comfortable with all the colorization methods and especially layered modes.

 

[slippifishi]

Excellent, thanks lucky

[Rene368]

I don't know if this is the right topic, but I think it is the best place to start.

 

I'm in the process of designing a shield for these types of displays, to give a cheaper alternative to the EVO HD board. I will publish it for the community.

It features the layout from the DC-DC converter PCB, so you won't have to buy that PCB separately just add the DC-DC module. And the WPC molex terminal and 2x screw terminals (8V-36V & 5V input) for easy connecting.

I contacted the chinese seller for the dimensions and got them (P1.875 display.jpg, lowest picture).

But it seems like the chinese have different variants for the mounting holes on the LED panels. I already know there are 4 different versions and have attached pictures of them. Maybe there are more.

Because I want to design the shield for as much variants as possible, I would like to ask the people in this topic who already bought the panels if you could measure your version and give me the dimensions. 

Hope you all can help me.

 

Thanks.

-René

 

Edited September 20, 2021 by Rene368

[lucky1]

8 hours ago, Rene368 said:

I don't know if this is the right topic, but I think it is the best place to start.

 

I'm in the process of designing a shield for these types of displays, to give a cheaper alternative to the EVO HD board. I will publish it for the community.

It features the layout from the DC-DC converter PCB, so you won't have to buy that PCB separately just add the DC-DC module. And the WPC molex terminal and 2x screw terminals (8V-36V & 5V input) for easy connecting.

I contacted the chinese seller for the dimensions and got them (P1.875 display.jpg, lowest picture).

But it seems like the chinese have different variants for the mounting holes on the LED panels. I already know there are 4 different versions and have attached pictures of them. Maybe there are more.

Because I want to design the shield for as much variants as possible, I would like to ask the people in this topic who already bought the panels if you could measure your version and give me the dimensions. 

Hope you all can help me.

 

Thanks.

-René

 

 

Do you want to make a shield in the size of a EVO HD panel ? Why that ? Why not make a shield like the V4 which ist 100x100mm which is cheap to order from china and then mount the panels to a acrylic frame like done before with the Nucleo based 128x32 and 192x64 PIN2DMDs ?

[Terranigma]

1 hour ago, lucky1 said:

Do you want to make a shield in the size of a EVO HD panel ? Why that ? Why not make a shield like the V4 which ist 100x100mm which is cheap to order from china and then mount the panels to a acrylic frame like done before with the Nucleo based 128x32 and 192x64 PIN2DMDs ?

I think that is the general idea, to make the shield smaller, not the size of the overall panel because that would not fit Data east etc anyways as the original is too big. I’m working with René on a few things and can provide him with measurements as a base. But ideally it would fit in all systems and be compatible with the correct nucleo etc with the correct chip.

[Rene368]

2 hours ago, lucky1 said:

Do you want to make a shield in the size of a EVO HD panel ? Why that ? Why not make a shield like the V4 which ist 100x100mm which is cheap to order from china and then mount the panels to a acrylic frame like done before with the Nucleo based 128x32 and 192x64 PIN2DMDs ?

The previous versions where screwed straight to the displays mounting holes with acrylic panel between. I would do the same, but these panels are larger. So it would get bigger to mount it to the corner mounting holes in the panel.

I thought it would be nice to include the DC-DC converter on the PCB, because it would be bigger. But you're right, then it would cost more. But as it is a DIY PCB I thought you could also buy it at another PCB manufacture like JLCPCB.

Also as Terranigma mentions it will not fit DE machines.

So do you both think a 100x100mm is a better idea and then the DC-DC converter still separate? Or maybe 2 version with and without DC-DC converter build in?

 

Whatever version I make, I still need the dimensions for the panels so I know the mounting holes of the different types.

[lucky1]

I know of at least 5 different pcb versions of those panels which all have different positions of the power and the HUB75 connector. That is why I have 3 different positions of solder pads for the power connector and a HUB75 pinheader for each panel . I think your shield should be as universal as possible for that reason. 

 

53 minutes ago, Rene368 said:

Also as Terranigma mentions it will not fit DE machines.

 

Why that ? You need a new speaker panel anyways and I don´t see any reason why the display itself should not fit.

 

55 minutes ago, Rene368 said:

Whatever version I make, I still need the dimensions for the panels so I know the mounting holes of the different types.

 

There are no mounting holes on these panels. They have magnets instead. Although some of them are screwed others are glued. I used DIN921 large head screws to which the magnets attach. See here

 

I would vote for a simple 100x100mm shield and let the DIY user make the other decisions depending on the panels he received.

[Flipperdoktor]

Interesting project

Would this 256x64 Display work in a Capcom "Flipper Football", or could it be adapted?

 

Mine has broken glass and I can't find a replacement.

Grateful for any kind of help
greetz
Gábor

[Rene368]

2 hours ago, lucky1 said:

I know of at least 5 different pcb versions of those panels which all have different positions of the power and the HUB75 connector. That is why I have 3 different positions of solder pads for the power connector and a HUB75 pinheader for each panel . I think your shield should be as universal as possible for that reason. 

The idea was to put the shield in the middle of the two displays and then connect the power wires and ribbon cables to the shield. I attatched a picture of what I've got so far. Also the 74HCT245 are quite big in through hole version.

 

So it would be universal in that sense, but bigger because the DC-DC converter is build on.

 

2 hours ago, lucky1 said:

I would vote for a simple 100x100mm shield and let the DIY user make the other decisions depending on the panels he received.

I get the feeling there are not alot of users that change the layout of the Eagle files, so that's why I wanted to create one with as much features as possible, so this display HD will be more created.

 

But I could make a 100x100mm shield if people would like to DIY.

Would like to get more feedback on the current design.

[lucky1]

2 hours ago, Flipperdoktor said:

Interesting project

Would this 256x64 Display work in a Capcom "Flipper Football", or could it be adapted?

 

Mine has broken glass and I can't find a replacement.

Grateful for any kind of help
greetz
Gábor

 

Technically I could get it to work if I have a Logic Analyzer Recording to see how data is sent out on that Capcom machine. However the screensize is bigger than the screensize of the original plasma display . You may need to adjust the cutout for the display.

[lucky1]

5 minutes ago, Rene368 said:

The idea was to put the shield in the middle of the two displays and then connect the power wires and ribbon cables to the shield. I attatched a picture of what I've got so far. Also the 74HCT245 are quite big in through hole version.

 

So it would be universal in that sense, but bigger because the DC-DC converter is build on.

 

I get the feeling there are not alot of users that change the layout of the Eagle files, so that's why I wanted to create one with as much features as possible, so this display HD will be more created.

 

But I could make a 100x100mm shield if people would like to DIY.

Would like to get more feedback on the current design.

 

You can remove the ESP32 , the battery and the connectors for DHT11, PIR, IR and the CAN TCVR.

Those are only used by the GO-DMD clock which does not support those panels and the project is end of development.

[Rene368]

44 minutes ago, lucky1 said:

You can remove the ESP32 , the battery and the connectors for DHT11, PIR, IR and the CAN TCVR.

Those are only used by the GO-DMD clock which does not support those panels and the project is end of development.

This is some usefull information! I will remove those components/connectors.

 

What about the RS232 and 3V3 TTL headers? Also I put the SWD header on it just in case, but I don't think this is needed?

Edited September 21, 2021 by Rene368

[lucky1]

3 hours ago, Rene368 said:

What about the RS232 and 3V3 TTL headers? Also I put the SWD header on it just in case, but I don't think this is needed?

 

The RS232 and 3V3 TTL header is needed for event keyframes which can trigger external stuff. 

SWD is not needed because it is already onboard of the Nucleo.

[danieldejuan]

i´m trying to mount an EVO256 but have any  references lost, not really lost so i can´t find in any distributor, or they sell minimum qty of 2500 ud. the references that i can´t  find are:

-ts2940cp33

-fcm1608kf-601t03

i found at digikey forum a  post who tell about a cross reference , BBNQ00160808601Y00   https://forum.digikey.com/t/fcm1608kf-601t03-cross-reference/8071 my question is about if you know if is  a valid component.

thank you so much 

[lucky1]

18 hours ago, danieldejuan said:

i´m trying to mount an EVO256 but have any  references lost, not really lost so i can´t find in any distributor, or they sell minimum qty of 2500 ud. the references that i can´t  find are:

-ts2940cp33

-fcm1608kf-601t03

i found at digikey forum a  post who tell about a cross reference , BBNQ00160808601Y00   https://forum.digikey.com/t/fcm1608kf-601t03-cross-reference/8071 my question is about if you know if is  a valid component.

thank you so much 

 

 

[Rene368]

So as of now I have 2 versions of my shield design. I have included some pictures of the 2 boards.

The difference between the two are the DC-DC converters: The first one includes the larger DC-DC converter (XL4015). The second one has a smaller MINI560 DC-DC converter. This MINI560 is cheaper, but not adjustable (maybe better so you won't fry it with the stock high voltage?).

 

The boards are 120x120 (same height as the LED panels). The ribbon cables for the LED panels should connect to the lower left and lower right corner connectors (HUB75E1 & HUB75E2) with the included ribbon cables from the panels.

The power wires should be cut to length and soldered to the 5V & GND pads on the left and right side of the board. 

I also included 2 SD card designs: the chinese one from the normal V4 shield and an adafruit one: https://www.adafruit.com/product/4682. So people can choose what to solder on.

 

I would like to get some feedback on the designs so I can decide which one to publish.

Also if there are questions, feel free to ask them.

 

P.S. the boards can be made cheaper at JLCPCB (I have great experience with them), so the 120x120mm dimension should not be an issue in my opinion.

[lucky1]

1 hour ago, Rene368 said:

I would like to get some feedback on the designs so I can decide which one to publish.

Also if there are questions, feel free to ask them.

 

Looks good ! Here is my input.

 

- Remove SJ1 from your design. Usage without LS123 is not supported in the firmware for all current designs.

- I would not offer the Mini560 alternative. I don´t have much trust in running several Amps for all the LEDs over such small pins and routes and it is still recommended to set the voltage to 4.8V, which is not possible with the Mini560.

 

and why version 4.0 ? Isn´t it V1.0 of the HD shield ?

[Rene368]

11 minutes ago, lucky1 said:

- Remove SJ1 from your design. Usage without LS123 is not supported in the firmware for all current designs.

Ok. But you also have this jumper in the EVO HD design. I just copied it.

It's in the same way connected as in your design: in off the signal goes through the LS123, in on the signal takes the shorter route overruling the LS123. Please see attatched picture.

Maybe you could clarify this for me.

 

21 minutes ago, lucky1 said:

- I would not offer the Mini560 alternative. I don´t have much trust in running several Amps for all the LEDs over such small pins and routes and it is still recommended to set the voltage to 4.8V, which is not possible with the Mini560.

Alright. I don't trust the chinese XL4015 designs either. But the adjustable voltage may become it's handycap, so good point. Let's not use the MINI560.

 

26 minutes ago, lucky1 said:

and why version 4.0 ? Isn´t it V1.0 of the HD shield ?

Because referenced to the V4 shield design. But yes, it's better to name it V1.0 HD shield.

 

Thanks.