Content Provider lucky1 Posted August 13, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 13, 2023 22 hours ago, Dazz said: The changing from vni/pal to pac was reactive to me receiving legal contact regarding colorizations. Exactly 12 hours ago, Dazz said: PAC *IS* a commercial format that was simply added to allow colorization authors to monetize their colorizations for REAL Pinball machines.... at the cost of digital/virtual pinball. NO ! Additionally to the first argument above PAC is a vpin only format which allows the authors to have their colorizations to be used for free on vpins while in the same time preventing their work to be used for real pinball machines and therefore their work being monetized with them being unable to do something against it. I guess the same will happen to serum in the near future when it is coming to real pinball machines with AlphaDMD and the colorization authors realize that their work is sold together with hardware for real pinball machines and they can do nothing about it. Funny side fact - The developer of AlphaDMD started his project with the idea to use VNI files for real pinball machines. I think you will receive legal contact again soon about the serum files. So maybe you should think about to stop hosting them too or is this a legal threat you don´t have to care about because it is open source ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okerra Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 From my point of view pin2dmd has become a hostile element, in which it only looks out for its monetary interests, do they give up their colors to vpin? Yes, but in the end it is still interesting since it is their form of advertising for real pinball, they cannot directly do it since it is forbidden to sell it as they do without having the licenses. I am not saying that everyone does it, but it is clear that the behavior gives away more than one person. Do you think if vpuniverse sold them instead of hosting the tables for free it would still stand? NO, because that is the problem of trading with licenses that are not yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider lucky1 Posted August 13, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 13, 2023 10 minutes ago, okerra said: Yes, but in the end it is still interesting since it is their form of advertising for real pinball What do you think how many real pin users care or know about this website ? Where is the advertising factor ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slippifishi Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 17 hours ago, freezy said: I have a lot more choices. I will pick the one that is most beneficial to the community and as little as possible hurtful to lucky1 and the monetizing coloring authors. It's commendable that you are still persisting in you quest to find an amicable solution that will give the user base the most benefit, you have the patience of a saint Freezy 1 hour ago, lucky1 said: Funny side fact - The developer of AlphaDMD started his project with the idea to use VNI files for real pinball machines. Indeed, usul is over on pinside talking about how alphaDMD can run VNI files; he's running my one of my VNI projects on his DMD or so he claims. He says he won't explore the avenue any further (presumably after he was asked not to here), but he also says he will explain how this can be carried out and is apparently willing for someone else to continue his work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freezy Posted August 13, 2023 Author Share Posted August 13, 2023 8 hours ago, slippifishi said: It's commendable that you are still persisting in you quest to find an amicable solution Well, I said "as little as possible" - it'll probably still hurt quite a bit.. 😳 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marccy1138 Posted August 14, 2023 Share Posted August 14, 2023 Wow....A complicated and obviously multifaceted issue. I just want to add a few words as I have been learning and admiring this hobby/community since I got my first machine 2.5 years ago. I knew nothing when I first started and thanks to the community I now know more than enough to be dangerous. Emphasis on "thanks to the community". Without it, there isn't a hobby. We all know that. Innovations, formats, etc. are awesome in the hobby and a lot has happened in the last 18 months on that front (Colorization, 64bit, etc etc). It is those guys we all know who make that stuff possible for the community. Colorizations are one of the things I love most. The time and effort to do these is astounding. I don't pretend to know the technical nuances, legalities or personalities that have hindered this area lately but as a community member/consumer I obviously want what is easiest (we all know this hobby is complicated enough). If the pac files will be banned or not supported any further then ok. Alternatively, if we will be confronted with always having to wait for plugin updates, then for me I would drop my pac files. Do we just revert back to .pal/.vni for those tables and then we can use Freezy exclusively? In other words, did pac provide any technical advantages or was it just to solve monetization issues? Serum doesn't seem to be an issue and works fine. It's frustrating for many and I see that in the chains we have all been following. Personally, I'm waiving the white flag and just wondering what is the best route for the "player/consumer" like me? To be clear, I am not taking sides and only care about the community as it is so vital to the "health" of the hobby. I personally would hate to see the great "minds" of this community who we all rely on become frustrated and simply stop supporting as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freezy Posted August 14, 2023 Author Share Posted August 14, 2023 2.2.0 final is released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeDASpike Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 On 8/15/2023 at 1:03 AM, freezy said: 2.2.0 final is released. Is the post deleted ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 24 minutes ago, MikeDASpike said: Is the post deleted ? seems so. I'm just curious who we go to when wcs_l2 pal/vni colorization not working? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeDASpike Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 52 minutes ago, Cliffy said: seems so. I'm just curious who we go to when wcs_l2 pal/vni colorization not working? I created an issue on github. It will be fixed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 7 minutes ago, MikeDASpike said: I created an issue on github. It will be fixed Ah ok. Someone should have laid down the new support rules here for all to see. So who's github did you post the bug report to please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeDASpike Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 8 minutes ago, Cliffy said: Ah ok. Someone should have laid down the new support rules here for all to see. So who's github did you post the bug report to please? I posted the girhub in the 2.2.0 post But here it is https://github.com/freezy/dmd-extensions/issues/400 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 4 minutes ago, MikeDASpike said: I posted the girhub in the 2.2.0 post But here it is https://github.com/freezy/dmd-extensions/issues/400 added verification to your posted issue. Thanks mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narc0lep5y Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 The link to the 2.2 final page works again. 1 hour ago, MikeDASpike said: Is the post deleted ? On 8/14/2023 at 7:03 PM, freezy said: 2.2.0 final is released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider CarnyPriest Posted August 17, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 17, 2023 46 minutes ago, Narc0lep5y said: The link to the 2.2 final page works again. Good! I'd much rather see the discussion locked than deleted. If users want to see why things are the way they are, they can read and decide for themselves. Better than a vacuum with nothing but whispers and conspiracy theories to fill it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lafester Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 55 minutes ago, MikeDASpike said: I posted the girhub in the 2.2.0 post But here it is https://github.com/freezy/dmd-extensions/issues/400 wcs is working fine here, strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 17 minutes ago, lafester said: wcs is working fine here, strange. Yes it works with freezys dmddevice.dll 2.2.0 dated 8/10/2023 but not with the newer one dated 8/14/2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider CarnyPriest Posted August 17, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 17, 2023 Which project? I recall two of them, but I don't have the specifics now. One was on github and was it 32assassin for the other one? Edit: malenko @Terranigma is editing the primary list: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider Terranigma Posted August 17, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 17, 2023 3 hours ago, CarnyPriest said: Which project? I recall two of them, but I don't have the specifics now. One was on github and was it 32assassin for the other one? Edit: malenko @Terranigma is editing the primary list: Will try get it back up asap! For those files, they aren't affected by the update so here are the links: World Cup Soccer - Complete - Author: @malenko @DJRobX - Vpin Download - Project Files & Real/Vpin Files World Cup Soccer - Author: @KOAmps - VPIN/Real Pin + Project Files Download Hopefully one or the other will work for you. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 3 hours ago, CarnyPriest said: Which project? I recall two of them, but I don't have the specifics now. One was on github and was it 32assassin for the other one? Edit: malenko @Terranigma is editing the primary list: Malenkos. the KOAmps version is only black and white as far as I can tell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider CarnyPriest Posted August 18, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 18, 2023 Looks like I had KOAmps installed but not working either. However, it was the first time I tried it out. I don't know if it worked before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeDASpike Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 1 hour ago, CarnyPriest said: Looks like I had KOAmps installed but not working either. However, it was the first time I tried it out. I don't know if it worked before. Check the dmddevice.log if it is throwing out an error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider CarnyPriest Posted August 18, 2023 Content Provider Share Posted August 18, 2023 Nothing jumps out at me. I actually don't have a lot of tables installed. STTNG is another one that I have with pal/vni, and it produces similar log output but appears to be working correctly. I can't delve much further into it at the moment. Just confirming Cliffy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lafester Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 On 8/17/2023 at 12:22 PM, Cliffy said: Yes it works with freezys dmddevice.dll 2.2.0 dated 8/10/2023 but not with the newer one dated 8/14/2023 I've had quite the journey since this post. I had installed the lucky files by mistake so that is why everything was working. After installing 2.2.0 I was having issues with .pac and then my pc crashed during an update/reboot. I got that fixed and have been trying to get pac working with no luck. I assume my plugin script or pin2color dll files are causing the issue, but so far I have not been able to resolve. Reverting to lucky files everything works again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeDASpike Posted August 19, 2023 Share Posted August 19, 2023 6 hours ago, lafester said: I've had quite the journey since this post. I had installed the lucky files by mistake so that is why everything was working. After installing 2.2.0 I was having issues with .pac and then my pc crashed during an update/reboot. I got that fixed and have been trying to get pac working with no luck. I assume my plugin script or pin2color dll files are causing the issue, but so far I have not been able to resolve. Reverting to lucky files everything works again. Just remove the pin2color(64).DLL's and serum964).dll's files from your vpinamme folder. Download latest Freezy 2.2.0. from github and put only the the dmddevice(64).dll's in your folder. This should make all go to work (Not sure if you use vpinmame 32 or 64 bit, so you only need those dll's) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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