shimoda Posted March 4, 2013 Share Posted March 4, 2013 This goes out to gfxb or anyone else. I noticed on another post that gfxb was making an Avengers table from an Indy Stern. Wondering if stripping a table back and using basic geometries would be a good idea or if this would be frowned upon. I have no experience with building anything in Future Pinball and would be doing everything from scratch, not to mention not knowing the scripting but I'd like to start somewhere with a longterm plan to get a nice table out there. Suggestion, info welcome. I guess the best place to start would be on artwork right? My theme is the Plasticman comic books, if I can find where I put them. I have a series of four so the 'missions' would be based on those issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faralos Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 if you are gonna' build a pin why not build a good one with VP rather than the crappy physics based FP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimoda Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 Yes faralos, I know you are the VP guy and I enjoy some of your tables. A couple reasons. I won't have a pin cab for a while and FP is so easy to get running with a rotated monitor (just switch camera setting). It's probably not the best reason but my one or two attempts at rotating single monitor (desktop) pins to run this way in VP hasn't resulted in viewable tables for whatever reason. The FP editor, while not the easiest to work with seems somewhat more straighforward than VP and the tables do look much nicer to be honest. I appreciate that someone responded. I'd also love to hear why VP is better for building beyond physics. I'm using 2.4 physics with FP and like the way it plays fine. Again, I'll take your thoughts into consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimoda Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 Actually, faralos, on this note, where would one go for basic table building instructions? FP has a decent manual but the VP chm seems to just have numbers and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob5453 Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 if you are gonna' build a pin why not build a good one with VPrather than the crappy physics based FP Seriously, show me one of your VP tables that wouldn't be better if it was built with FP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimoda Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 What I'm more curious about between the two is 3D objects. Modeling in VP versus FP that is. What tools are available for each? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faralos Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 try reading this for help with vp http://www.armuco.ch/bubble/VisualGuidehtml/indexGB.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faralos Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 vp has way more programmers willing to lend a hand whereas with FP I had no one who would help me back when I first started so I switched to vp to build with the manuals are few and far between for vp but then again vp is always being worked on and FP ain't since it is closed source I think it's easier to actually create from scratch most any pf toy with vp than it is to make something with fp and there is more free form creativity with vp and making a custom play field than with fp personal preference really but I love vp whereas I only barely tolerate FP I do play pins made with both editors I just prefer vp over fp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loafmeister Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 if you are gonna' build a pin why not build a good one with VP rather than the crappy physics based FP Whether at VPF, here, or at gopinball, I am really getting tired of these types of posts. In a thread that says "VP vs FP", knock yourself out. In a thread that says "what do you think of x physics?", knock yourself out. But when the OP is asking for an opinion that has nothing to do with physics, why do you and others feel the need to crap on FP? There is nothing wrong with speaking ones mind but to put it in perspective Faralos, what would you say if in every vp desktop release thread, I would pop in and say "you guys are wasting your time, desktop sucks" Whether FP physics sucks or not, it obviously does not suck for everyone. There is a time and place for every discussion, if physics are not the subject, why bring it in all the time? From a guy with over 6500 posts at VPF, I expect more... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Dazz Posted March 6, 2013 Administrators Share Posted March 6, 2013 It's Faralos... he can never stay on topic. But... let's leave the FP vs VP fights on the other sites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimoda Posted March 6, 2013 Author Share Posted March 6, 2013 To address both points (FP and VP), bob is right to point out that I didn't ask that question. I asked for direction or advice and figured since this is a new forum we could start by adding some of these resources early on. I've looked into Itchigo's templates for VP and they're great. I've also looked into the VP tutorial projects people have going on. For VP, it would simply be nice to have a MANUAL like FP has that be supported. Since VP IS open source, I'm somewhat surprised, and somewhat not by this. Faralos also offered some advice, again on a question I didn't ask, but I won't hold it against him. I'll all with Dazz here that I want to see things stay positive here. Frankly I might try both programs just to see how things go but my original question was still not answered. I think this is a valid question. It is a conversation that I think would be great for users of either program. Despite the fact that different people will start out a project like this differently, it usually remains that there is a 'better' course of action to follow. So, again my question to get back on track: What do developers recommend as the best place to start a table build? Is it placement of parts then playfield? Concept? Artwork? This is in regards to Future Pinball. I think this could just as easily be asked for VP, in the Planet VP forum area. My reasoning is that each program likely has a smoother course of creation and it'd be nice to avoid doing twenty steps only to find that I should have started in a different place to avoid that. If I figure this out on my own, I'll document it. Speaking of which, if I figure this out I'll try to make some HyperSpin style tutorials (the ones I made are now on the 'oldsite' linked to Docs on the site) with clearly written steps and videos where they seem to be needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider Itchigo Posted March 7, 2013 Content Provider Share Posted March 7, 2013 To be honest, It can be any of the above. I usually build, find a concept, then do artwork and sounds along those lines. But it can be any direction. Cowboys and Indians was built before I had a theme or artwork. Olympics, I already have completely built- without a playfield image. Since every table is different, there really is no "rulebook" on how to build. It's more like, I want to do this, how do I do it? Then you either ask, or find a demo table and learn from it. I've never worried about the whole fp/vp thing. I look at it this way- they're both fun- that's their purpose, right? The whole purpose of vp and fp is to have fun and enjoy playing no matter how good or bad they are. I stick with vp because it's what I know. I've always wanted to try an fp table, but I don't really have the time to learn both. I did enjoy desktop fp, but don't have the time to mod each table (of a couple hundred) to fs for my cab when I can add a few lines to the script for a downloaded vp table. Hope this helps, and thanks for the compliments on my template. This may help, I forgot about it. I zipped it incase it wouldn't be accepted as a pdf. VP_9.1.1_Documentation_and_Help_v1.0.zip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimoda Posted March 8, 2013 Author Share Posted March 8, 2013 I'd like to know more ago the script, maybe it's in your PDF? Actually it's way easier to modify FP to cabinet since it: 1) supports dual monitors natively 2) all you have to do is switch camera view It would be great if vp had this simple of cabinet setup. You do have to size tables individually, though it doesn't take too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider Itchigo Posted March 9, 2013 Content Provider Share Posted March 9, 2013 You mean more about the scripting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimoda Posted March 9, 2013 Author Share Posted March 9, 2013 I was referring to your comment about changing the tables to fs by just adding a couple of lines to the script in vp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Content Provider Itchigo Posted March 15, 2013 Content Provider Share Posted March 15, 2013 Sorry I missed this. To change to fs you have to change the x/y scale and position in the backdrop. It's trial and error. FP is easier in this respect, but when you get a feel for it, it's not too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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