Trigon Xse (Wip)

[shiva]

A while back I mentioned I was going to rebuild/redo Trigon and the very first video is now up and running, featuring the work as it stands right now. This table is roughly 50% complete, a lot of things are missing, or needs to be worked on (like plastics, new lens system etc)

 

This demonstrates the table as it stands right now, but several new things I have created just for this release, featuring a new dynamic playfield and lighting system. It's really hard to describe, but the video should give you a real good idea of what I have done. 

 

Note that the PF itself isn't finished, it still needs to be darkened and lit with the table yet, that is down the road

The video shows the attract mode, is running the original script, and is fully playable. It also shows the FPS counter, so you can see the amount of stress that is on the cpu, especially during the "extreme" rapidly blinking portions.

The recording software takes a large amount of the FPS, the actual average FPS on a i core 7 with 8 gigs and GTX960 is 525 FPS with a 25 - 40 fps drop when everything is flashing rapidly. Please note that there is still a lot of optimization yet to be done for both the table objects and modification of the script to reduce the load. The more I save, the more I can use later on...

This table is completely rebuilt with new layout and graphics, and is running under the old script.

The dynamic systems are switchable On and Off, and also adjustable with the light intensity. This is roughly medium settings.

Here is the roadmap for the rest of the build pretty much in the order I will be doing it:

1. script work and fix all the timing issues and other things due to all the changes within VP.
2. Continue work on the pf art, set the lens locations
3. custom light lens system
4. custom physics system
5. Finish the pf with remaining artwork, line work, ornaments and text, add more lighting and shadows to lighting system
6. Finish the small scale graphics
7. plastics artwork
8. Replace the text based display system with a better one
9. New audio work
10. Add a menu system
11. change and expand the rules
12. add some more stuff, anything else I think of while doing the table.

sorry, forgot to turn the sound back on...

You can view the video right here:
https://youtu.be/bxibnNu1oUc

Also included is the raw/unlit playfield art, also at 50% completion. As you can tell, a lot has changed since the last time I showed it, but I never could leave anything alone.

 

The WIP thread can be found here:

http://www.pinballnirvana.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12991

[Wildman]

Looks great so far...Cant wait to see the finished table

[shiva]

I can't wait either, I wish I would hurry up and finish it 

 

After this is done, maybe I should write out somethings about what I have discovered when everyone just follows one persons way and not experiment. I just made that mistake, and wasted 3 weeks and wiped out a lot of work.

In my defense though, it's been at least 6 years since I really did anything, so I have completely forgotten everything, and also learn all the new things in VP since then. Add to that the lack of proper information or info that is scattered all over the place, it makes it rather difficult. I spent days looking at information and how to's, saw everyone use the exact same method, so I did it that way, only to watch a huge load on the table that dropped to 20 FPS on a pretty decent computer. To make matters worse, the key thing that I really needed to know I only just found mentioned offhand in a thread about something completely different. I woke up the kid swearing at the computer soon as I saw it.

 

As soon as I wiped out all that work, and tested the table, I gained over 200 FPS instantly, even not switching the graphics. Instead of every 10 objects, I now have just one at a fraction of the load. I also used Eala's post with ramps for hidden locations, removing those right now and replacing a couple with primitives that may be viewable, I just gained about 25 frames per second. Just replacing more with other ways I will gain even more. (At the moment, I am now averaging over 600 FPS at full bore, which is very important to keep as high as possible for multiball, or if I want to add a active ball system or advanced physics down the road)

 

It doesn't mean my way is any better, it requires patience, it's just the way that works best for this table. I wanted those dynamic effects, and there is always a trade off no matter what I use. But, as the expression goes, there is more than one way to skin a cat after all. 

 

I don't know how successful this idea is, that's what a alpha release will solve. I guess I will find out if other devs see it, and steal the idea for their own tables. 

 

BTW, you can also make perfectly round rubbers with one ramp object, you don't need 10. The trade off is the shadowing, and it has depth bias problems, but it's pretty easy to do.

[ICPjuggla]

Is this being built in VPX?

[shiva]

no 9.9.2

Simple reasons really. It's far to complex for me, with way more things to learn, and even less information than what I would need, and most of it is just gobbygook now, I'm not a rocket scientist.There are a lot more steps needed, and the material system itself would add even more time with it's extra steps and more testing.  I have to create not just the graphics and the materials,  but remake the entire table from scratch. A large part of the script would have to be rewritten as well on top of it, due to all the changes within vpx,  as it does nothing but give me massive errors now, and Trigon has the largest script ever made as it is, not including the thousands of extra lines that may be needed on top of that. This is all on top of 6 years of doing nothing but forgetting everything I learned before.

 

It's hard to justify the enormous amount of time and extra work for a non-VPINMAME table, and I decided it just isn't worth all that extra time to me, when I'm far more comfortable with using vp9. it's a lot closer to what I am use to, I can get the game out far faster, and it still will be a far superior version than the original.  If I was ever to do a vpx game, and had that time to do it, I would do a design that was far simpler, there is no way I want to do anything complex for a first table with vpx, especially when it's the most insanely complex game ever done for straight VP.

[ICPjuggla]

It's actually a lot easier to build a table in VPX than it is in VP9.

VPX does a lot of things for you that you won't have to waiste your time with, doing it in VP9..

The physics a lone in VPX would make it worth it... In my opinion

There are a lot of materials already made you can import to use in your build.. Honestly it would only take a few days maybe even a few hours if your motivated to convert to VPX seeing how far you have it already.. All you would have to do is set the materials, fix the command scripts for VPX and create the lighting you want to use and you'd be all set.. And if you really wanted but it looks like your already familiar with primitives add VPX objects like rubbers etc. etc.

With over 150 VPX tables already created you could look at some examples to get yourself started, it would really be easier than you think.. VPX is really user friendly now, much more so than VP9..

Anyway, cool theme and great progress so far...

[shiva]

That is what I decided, and it is not worth my time to have to spend months of extra time. It doesn't really matter to me which program is better, I only choose the one that I know I can use, same as everyone else would.

[ICPjuggla]

Honestly both programs are the same VPX is just a beefed up VP9..

Like I said it wouldn't take months at most a few days.

If you would like help converting the table just ask.. If not my self there are others that would step up to lend a hand too..

Remember, change is good don't be afrade of it.. :-)

[Scorpion]

Hello, some news?